American may expand Starlink Wi-Fi beyond its A320 fleet to all mainline aircraft, a move that could give it a real edge over Delta.
Happy to see it happen if true. Would be a pain to try to find bookings on Airbus flights just to get access to Starlink. Hope it'll be a fast install.
I really struggle to understand your disdain for Delta’s decision to not opt for Starlink. Do you really think, consumers will switch their airlines simply because the wifi onboard is slow or not as fast as competitors? Even when the quality of service is on par, people will be like, nah I am going to book United/AA because they have faster wifi?
I am certain Delta’s reason to not work with Starlink are selfish, but I am happy that (for whatever reason) at least 1 airline isn’t going to give business to a narcissist, xenophobic, racist, egomaniac piece of shit dirtbag.
@ Ole -- I totally agree with everything you say about Musk, of course, and I hate how he currently has a monopoly on high speed Wi-Fi. We're on the same page.
Am I suggesting that people will switch exclusively because one airline has faster Wi-Fi? Well, no, probably not. The point is that customers choose an airline based on the combination of a wide variety of factors. Like, people don't fly United just because they have Starlink, or just because they have Polaris Lounges, or just because they have cold brew, or just because they have a great app. But the idea is that the more competitive advantages you have, the more likely you are to win customers who are seeking a combination of price, value, and experience.
That's the whole argument in favor of airlines becoming more "premium," and not just getting passengers who are seeking the lowest fare.
It’s just funny everybody clowning Delta for not choosing starlink, but then also want competition on airfare, hotel fares, everything but wants all the airlines to just join musks monopoly
It will be a non-topic soon enough and most airlines will regret choosing Starlink. Elon is very unstable.
@Ben, I agree with the overall product being competitive and provide best possible experience/service. I also agree with you about having as many competitive advantages as one can get, but my point is I don't think faster wifi is one of those deciding factor. I think, it is one of those features that customers will appreciate when they use it, but will not drive their decision making next time they are looking at flying.
I'd go one step further - people spend money on Delta cars because Amex has a premium aura, Delta has a premium aura, and "premium people" want to be premium and don't really care about being value hunters. How could they - they're earning skymiles.
So if AA and UA suddenly look "more premium" it helps with credit card acquisition which helps them get more money from Chase and Citi which helps their bottom line.
It's a bit of a self-perpetuating cycle. It's the antithesis of what that Spirit guy was saying the other day - their problem wasn't the existence of frequent flyer mile programs that could be used as collateral for loans, their problem was that their customer base was not premium and didn't acquire or spend a lot of money on Spirit credit cards.
You can hate the guy… but you can’t denied what he has accomplished. Many successful CEOs are assholes, just Elon is the most outspoken. Does that divide his public opinion yes, I’d say it also doesn’t help him in anyway, but if you govern your life decisions based on emotions then you’ll fail in life.
Look, people will absolutely choose planes with starlink vs not. Will it f up delta? Probably not. So if you prefer delta, fly delta, nothing wrong with that. But understand why other folks will switch. It’s just objectively a better online experience. Period.
@Davisson, you are clearly understating if you call that douchebag "outspoken" and "dividing opinions". By all objective unbiased measures, he is racist, xenophobic, narcissist, egomaniac and a ton more of similiar "adjectives". This is not about being emotional. It is about what is right and what is wrong, what is moral and what is immoral. Who says one can't be successful by being emotional? Clearly, our definition of success is different.
Another point we disagree on, is people choosing starlink vs not. I am not against anyone making their decision based on wifi. I just don't think wifi speed drives people's decision making when it comes to which airlines they will fly.
Assuming most people hate him for his politics. Boohoo, Elon is a genius, a trillionaire, and we are not.
That said, to OPs point, one data point on my end, I absolutely have chosen 3 recent flights on AF solely for Starlink. As I’m now a status “free agent” like many others booking long haul J, I can do more daytime hour work on long hauls on Air France than say, Iberia. Pretty sure I’m not a one off.
@Maria I'm curious - Let's say you need to book a flight and business class with Airline X (with starlink) is pricing at $7,000, but business class with Airline Y (without starlink - but a decent enough wifi) is pricing at $4,000; which are you going with?
For what it's worth, I fly for work and travel during work hours at high frequency, and Starlink is an incredible benefit for me. I already choose United because of better schedules than American out of Chicago, but if I were on the fence or it were close at all, Starlink would absolutely push me over the edge. Starlink is essentially a guarantee that I can actually work on the flight, whereas every legacy provider comes with the risk that half a day will be blown, which is really damaging.
I do not like Elon at all. In particular, I think he led to the deaths of an unthinkable number of people by killing USAID, all while eroding American soft power. But, Starlink is an excellent product and a game-changer for me.
no you wont book for faster WIFI but its a consideration 🙂 and trust me once you have had starlink on another airline you will understand its a BIG DEAL. 🙂
Yah airlines needs to get starlink installed. It’s a step up function in terms of productivity on the plane. I’m all for competition… I hope this forces blue origin to step it up quickly.
Am I the only one who could give a rats ass about wifi on airplanes?
I will avoid any airline that uses Starlink and if I must fly that airline, I will refuse to connect any device to Starlink
Why are you supporting this?
I'd say you people are beyond laughable but don't want to offed the beyond laughable crowd.
ideally you'd want to connect something with a direct tunnel to a trusted ground network (or VPN - i've heard a few reports that VPNs don't work on starlink but that seems like it would be complicated to actually enforce technologically, and i have yet to test it)
As a frequent Delta flyer, I actually do hope Delta loses business over the decision not to install Starlink. For a long time, I think Delta has been resting on its reputation, and it’s good for Delta flyers (and obviously flyers of other airlines) to see United and AA making clear improvements. Passengers will come out ahead when there is more and better competition.
On the other hand, I can’t help but feel Ben is getting perhaps a bit too much enjoyment out of trashing Delta over this decision. Delta led United and American for a significant period of time by having free WiFi when United and AA were charging for it — and I don’t seem to recall nearly as much criticism of those airlines back then for lagging Delta (or extensive praise for Delta for offering it).
People boycotting airlines or Starlink over Musk are beyond infantile. Do you boycott all Chinese products due to their human rights violations, or are you only selective when it’s easy? Your boycotts don’t work because nobody cares. I’ll be getting work done using Starlink while you have crappy wi-fi. But hey, you showed Musk, didn’t you?! lol.
And they aren't boycotting Bezos, Gates, Zuckerberg, etc either. They all have their own bad issues too.
Anyone who decides to fly an airline based on whether the carrier utilizes Starlink, or any other internet provider, is not to be taken seriously. This is no different than choosing an airline based upon whether they serve Coke or Pepsi.
My standard for airline loyalty (or even picking which one to fly) is based SOLELY on Price, Performance, Service and Schedule!
Not solely, but it can move the needle. I can tell you that after experiencing UA's free Starlink WiFi, it's now a differentiator in UA's favor when I need a tie breaker. And it's got me telling everyone how great it is.
A year of Starlink will not produce a significant shift in passengers from Delta to American.
Probably true. But as an Alaska elite, I actively avoid flying on AA because it doesn't measure up to AS.
The changes at AA will improve the airline for the better.
Ha! I am now only interested in an airline that will ban Starlink ease to connect vocally on a flight. Does this mean a Delta flight will be quieter than an American flight?
Hope Delta enjoys the WiFi cuck chair the next couple years!
I fly Delta. I would definitely switch for a carrier with better WiFi.
OH FFS. Say it ain't so.
I have been following this discussion with bemusement. Probably much older than most bloggers here. In "my day" (1980's and 90's) we had no wifi, nor the must haves that you all crave, like doors, surly flight attendants, and crappy food. And if you can believe it, no cell phones, until the 90's.
My boss would just remind me to check-in when I reached my destination( but not if he was sleeping).
Somehow we were happy campers, earning our rewards without the stress of 24 hour a day connectivity. We somehow won major contracts, solved customers problems, and still flew worldwide for free with FF miles. And certainly needed no spreadsheets to track our 20 plus credit cards.
Yes, I will carry my laptop, but only to edit my photos in Photoshop, for my blog. If it is a night flight, dinner and sleep.
Why all this stress and anger?
There are plenty of others in your camp, but increasingly for traditional white collar workers, everything we do is in the cloud. So to be productive on a flight (work on email, word documents, powerpoints, excel, etc.), an internet connection becomes almost essential so that you can collaborate in real-time and not mess up version control / editing, etc. Even the new outlook doesn't really function well without an internet connection.
So while it's not necessary for some types of jobs and for leisure travel, it is more of an expectation and table stakes for many of us to do almost anything productive. And now you can add working with Claude or ChatGPT to that list.
Americans have no job security and (probably rightly) fear they’ll be fired for not responding to an email for 10 hours while over the Pacific.
Other people have different experiences, interests, preferences, and responsibilities than you. I'm not sure a time where planes were filled with cigarette smoke was better than one with wi-fi.
Amen, brother! My job in airline operations required that I be available 24/7. They gave me a pager for that. If it buzzed, never a good sign, I called in. We eventually got BlackBerrys in the early-mid 90’s and cell phones in the late 90’s. We didn’t get laptops until the very late 90’s and back then they weren’t all that useful other than for email. Now we’re tied to our phones and laptops. It was said the laptop will free us. It didn’t.
I'm old myself, and I prefer things the way they used to be. To wit:
- Smoking sections. I want my freedom to light up returned.
- No women on board other than stewardesses. And they're stewardesses, not "flight attendants".
- No children on board unless grandma died and they need to get to the funeral quickly.
- Meals in Y. And we're talking real meals in all classes. Steak in Y, lobster in J or domestic F.
Now combine that with the modern developments of lounges and Starlink, and you have my perfect flight experience.
I'm curious if the moves from some major airlines (United, American, etc.) to Starlink will actually improve Viasat's performance (in terms of bandwidth availability, etc.) in the short-term in a way that will help it for airlines like Delta while they wait for Leo.
Starlink still performs better than Viasat ever has for me but if it's 'good enough' for Delta customers until Leo rolls out, it may only impact marginal bookings rather than cause a measurable customer loyalty shift.
Yes I remember the days of phones in seat although because of the cost few used them. Also, back then most people did not particularly want to have several rows of passengers listening into their phone call. Today people will discuss anything out loud with no humility.
Wifi is a nice to have but for me not critical. Most movies today are pathetic. I'd rather read a book or look out the window.
Ah the good old days.... 1990's. I made a call once on the GTE Airfone. My dad was amazed !
Why does everyone keep celebrating all these airlines' "free" Starlink?
It's free until Elon has another bad drug trip and decides to shut them down on mood or an hallucination telling him to do so, or to start charging the airlines some ungodly sum to use the "free" service once they're all locked in.
And before anyone says "the board won't let him do that!" his boards are no better than potted plants.
It -is- pretty astonishing, the amount of fiduciary breaches that all of Musk's companies allow him to get away with it. Can't recall anything else in the corporate world that even comes close.
The problem is that Delta has always associated itself with premium. Starlink is a premium household name. No one has ever heard of Viasat. So why they would pass up an opportunity to associate themselves with premium is beyond me - it's their whole schtick.
Is the goal of all these posts to somehow shame Delta into reversing course and installing Starlink? The frequency with which I'm reading that Delta is now the black sheep of the aviation world because they won't have Starlink is remarkable. You'd think they chose to fly planes without wings or something.
Is the secret formula to web traffic and engagement just the following:
1) insert airline that thinks/decides/announces a Starlink partnership is best for them
2) shakes fist at sky and yell at the clouds
3) how dare Delta not do the same
4) boom. engagement.
I can't wait for Air Burkina to announce they're installing Starlink on their two E190's tomorrow, and why that means Delta is failing the West African business community.
Until the CEO says something that annoys Elon and it gets shut down. Ask Ukraine how trusting him worked out for them.